} And I think some of what you were saying there was incredibly powerful. What if the cause is the lack of resources for local schools since theyre so based on property taxes? But for whatever reason, we dont engage in that form of analysis. On the other hand, it is widely believed that it is harmful politically to even use the R word, to describe someone as racist, to talk about racism, and that it is sort of political suicide to do so. eNotes.com will help you with any book or any question. Its another thing to never battle. And I wonder if you think thats still part of it here, that there is an implicit offer being made of, keep the wages of whiteness, even as you dont get actual higher wages, and whether thats one of the weak points of this coalition and also one of the fears it has as it comes under real attack? His argument there was that it doesnt matter what you intend, it doesnt matter what you feel, all that matters the only thing that matters is outcomes. And that then allows us as a community, as a multiracial community, or even within the Black community, if on the one hand its going to help, on the other hand, its going to hurt, to essentially make a decision. Rather than a list of dates or an interpretation of the Ibram X. Kendi's concept of antiracism reenergizes and reshapes the conversation about racial justice in America -- but even more fundamentally, points us toward liberating new ways of thinking about ourselves and each other. They even create a plan in which theyre going to track their success, and how theyre going to hold themselves accountable to being better and to growing and to making an impact. Both of those plans obviously had many different elements to them. So I found that actually it was racist policies that were then leading to racist ideas. Because I think what you just said there is really important. Even my own story, in How To Be An Antiracist, I document 20 years that it really took me to really grow and to move to be antiracist. Look at the soaring white support for interracial marriage decades after the policy changed in 1967. But if I teach you the source of your struggles, are those immigrants or those Black people or those people of color who have taken away your jobs, and Im trying to fight for you, then Im going to imagine that youre my messiah when, indeed, Im the source of your struggles. Kendi then addresses the intersectionality between racism and sexism, homophobia, and transphobia. What are the policies that happen alongside of it? It makes sense for so many people to have that in place. And so Id like to hear you talk a bit about what that might look like applied to questions of racial inequality. And Im going to ask some questions on how to do it. It dominates bestseller lists. So Ive been using defunding the police as an example of at least a controversy over what the effects of a policy that looks like it is in service of racial equality but theres controversy over what its outcomes will be. Thus racism led to deeper economic gulfs within American society, while also helping turn poor whites against Blacks seeking economic security rather than against Capitalist elites who kept them poor. So in this conversation, I wanted to know how he feels about the way his book and ideas have been deployed as they move from being a book and ideas to being at the center of such a society-wide change. IXK: I think we should understand the effect of the structural on the individual. You may do so in any reasonable manner, but not in any way that suggests the licensor endorses you or So whats it all been like for you? An example running through my head as you were talking is I recently did an interview with former President Obama. Kendi discusses the role of slavery in the economic, political, and religious systems of the early American colonies. And then we talk, of course, about the right-wing backlash to his ideas and the way the anti-critical race theory movement has used him as their central villain. [MUSIC PLAYING], The Ezra Klein Show is a production of New York Times Opinion. If things stayed as they were, they could exploit people in the same way. So I take your point that there are spaces where if you dont fight, its never going to happen. These ideas ignored the facts, but they steered the political discourse towards stances such as tough on crime and hard on drugs; in reality, these stances were fundamentally anti-Black. Christopher Rufo, whos sort of the architect of this push, said youre a leading figure in the critical theory movement. And what was happening was that people were producing racist ideas to defend or justify racist policies that oftentimes benefited them. And I Heather McGhees book is extraordinary on this. TLFS: We know that a lot of the framing around critical race theory has been incredibly successful. So he was trying to figure out other ways to affect her and I think, you know, the fact that he would use my work and distort it, and then to see how difficult it was for her in that moment, I think was very difficult for me to see. How do we change the narrative that fragile white children are somehow threatened by accurate teaching about racism? Word Count: 825. And so if that then raises racial inequality in crime victims, where does that end up under your framework? But I just think that for our bills we should be tracking the racial impact. IBRAM X. KENDI: I definitely think that that is still operating, and I think Donald Trump in particular was great, for the lack of a better term, at making particularly white working class, non-college educated men feel as if they were somebody in his eyes or they could be just like him or they were him in the way the slaveholder made those non-slaveholding whites believe that every laborer is a slaveholder. Are there times when you think you shouldnt say something because that will lead to someone terrible getting elected? Finally, Black people reinforce anti-Black racism through the powerless defensethe idea that Black people cant be racist because they have no power. I loved his previous book, Stamped From The Beginning, which I still think everyone should read, even if youve read, by the way, How To Be An Antiracist. But what struck me about How To Be An Antiracist was how intensely consequentialist Kendis views on racism had become. Theres no data that supports that, but thats what theyre advocating, and thats what theyre making people to believe, that if you reduce funding for the police, crime is going to grow. So I remember endlessly arguing during the passage of the Affordable Care Act about whether or not the Affordable Care Act would end up increasing budget deficits, which, by the way, it did not. And Im just going to drive right to the heart of controversy here. And on the other hand, you actually do need an answer both for police violence and for the conditions that underlie it. And also let me say, Ezra, from the standpoint of somebody who was a descendant of enslaved people, this was the actual conundrum that enslaved people had to deal with when they decided whether to join that slave revolt that somebody was organizing. And I think thats the question that weve never really wanted to answer because the assumption has always been that even if you provide a neighborhood, a Black neighborhood, an impoverished Black neighborhood, with more resources, with better schools, with more funding for public health and mental health services, with more jobs, that its not going to matter because the people are Black. There are a lot of folks publicly acknowledging their privilege and issuing statements of solidarity and claiming to be antiracist while doing very little to truly reduce racial inequality, doing very little of the analysis of action and speech that he demands. Struggling with distance learning? And I want to stick on this point for a bit because I think the consequentialist dimension of it was so interesting to me when I first came into contact with it. Hover to zoom. Below, a recap of their insights. Rather, it is a system of categorization that powerful people developed throughout history in order to divide and conquer other groups. 
But if somebody told or if the slave was found out or if the slave revolt was put down, it was likely death for everybody. And what I make of this whole fiasco I was surprised when I learned that I was the father of critical race theory, when critical race theory was born before I was born. I think thats a world to strive for. So I think of revolutions as an answer for when politics has failed, has truly failed. Free shipping. Am I wrongly attributing a view to you here? They had to appeal to voters that in many cases they have written off right now, that you would see a change in the ideas they argued for. He is a National Book Award-winning and #1 New York Times bestselling author of six books, including Stamped from the Beginning and How To Be An Antiracist. When it comes to race, Kendi argues that most Americans face what he calls dueling consciousness: Black Americans get stuck between assimilationism and antiracism, while white Americans often struggle to choose between segregationism and assimilationism. IBRAM X. KENDI: I think first and foremost, when we think of the funding that U.S. police receive, I dont think many Americans know that, I think a recent study found, that the combined funding of the U.S. police forces is more than every other military in the world except the Chinese and the American military. 5 Apr. What if the cause is the lack of resources for local schools since theyre so based on property taxes? A challenging discussion on hard, and sometimes unanswerable, questions around racism and policy. WebThere is no such thing as being "not racist," says author and historian Ibram X. Kendi. IBRAM X. KENDI: So if an individual has replaced the phrase, Im not racist, with the phrase, Im an antiracist, and really the only thing thats changed has been how they identify themselves, and they arent also talking about how they potentially reflected or even identified some of the maybe racist ideas that they have held, they arent willing to identify ways in which theyre actually supporting struggles for justice and equity, then to me thats just purely symbolism or their symbolic. Define and separate people by race, and people will vote by race, and Donald trump will be re-elected. Its very, very hard to get a person to do that in the matter of a few hours or in the matter of time that most of these trainings are. Lets say the cause of the crime is the amount of guns that are circulating throughout this nation. And so for me, if we were to replay that time, and if Obama would have came out and said, the Tea Party is racist and its being driven by racist ideas and that would then have led to a backlash which ultimately prevented the Affordable Care Act from passing, and so we had that option or the option of what he did, I would certainly choose and support him or someone else from not making that claim. 
That the race of the people really dont matter in this sense in the way that the poverty does. Jeffrey C. Stewart, in his review of How to Be an Antiracist for The New York Times, stated: Kendi is on a mission to push those of us who believe we are not racists to become something else: antiracists, who support ideas and policies affirming that the racial groups are equals in all their apparent differences that there is nothing right And the effects of that are about twice as large per capita for Black victims than for white ones. And Im just going to drive right to the heart of controversy here. It is produced by Jeff Geld, Roge Karma and Annie Galvin, fact-checked by Michelle Harris, original music by Isaac Jones, and mixing by Jeff Geld. Instant PDF downloads. Through an antiracist education, you can learn about white abolitionists who fought against slavery, white, civil rights activists who fought against Jim Crow. And I think that if there was anything thats happened over the last year that I think is clear to everyone is that the growing numbers of white Americans who not only marched and were among the tens of millions of people who demonstrated against racism and police brutality last summer, but the number of white Americans who are telling pollsters that, yeah, racism exists, and its a huge problem. And the reason why thats been so incredible to me is because it should be widely believed that the phrase, antiracist is code for antiwhite, was a white supremacist talking point for years. The second date is today's It demanded just a constant ongoing analysis of every policy, of every tactic, with no margin, really, offered for peoples good intentions in an uncertain world. So your book came out in the fall of 2019, How To Be An Antiracist. And we had a long talk about it then. He ends this passage by saying, basically and Im paraphrasing whatever truths history might suggest about the motivations of these folks, I knew it wasnt going to help me politically to call anybody racist. And I think on a policy thats going to have a mixed impact on racial disparities and inequities, thats when we, of course, have to make a decision. EZRA KLEIN: Fair enough. Learn how you can actively use this awareness to What would it be in a year, what would it be in 10 years? I dont know of any other way to describe it. Those are two different things, and I think I wanted to really push to ensure were understanding these as dangerous unemployed neighborhoods. Refine any search. Maintenance Phase is pivotal in contributing to a dramatic shift in our culture and the way But still, some people decided that they were going to do the unthinkable. Creating notes and highlights requires a free LitCharts account. And so I want to use a different example here. So let me then ask always a final question here. If theyre losing it now, well, the children are our future, and were going to try to win it there again. And thats been one of my questions about how this debate, which in some cases takes part under the auspices of your book, plays out because on the one hand, I think if youre just doing a very direct calculation, I think the evidence is that if you remove police, you will have an increase in the racial equality of homicides and violence, and that will have a terrible effect. Kendi addresses police violence, COVID-19 Kendi discussed two incidents involving Rochester police that made national newsa 9-year-old girl who was handcuffed and pepper sprayed following a domestic disturbance, and the case of Daniel Prude, who died after being physically restrained by officers while he was experiencing a mental How to Be an Antiracist - Hardcover By Kendi, Ibram X. 
We havent talked as much about how that crisis, the Cold War, was actually helpful to advancing civil rights legislation, especially during the Truman administration and the Kennedy and Johnson administrations. What are some important quotations fromMrs. Dallowaythat would be useful in essays? Thats it. }); The Laura Flanders Show: Where were you? Today, Kendi is a regular contributor to The Atlantic and the founding director of the Boston University Center for Antiracist Research. Ibram Kendi On Anti-Racism And His New Book, Be Antiracist : Life Kit Author and renowned scholar Ibram Kendi's new book asks readers to examine their own relationship with race. NPR's Eric Deggans spoke with him about it. And we have to come together to decide as a community, is this the type of policy we should pass? It's an ambitious experiment with a few flaws. So its not as if the police arent extremely well funded. But still, some people decided that they were going to do the unthinkable. And I think to complicate it even further, there will be policies that, lets say, close gaps between, lets say, Black people and white people and open gaps between, lets say, white people and Latinx people. On the other hand, because it boosts the price of stocks and other kinds of assets like that and we already have a big wealth gap, it ends up increasing the wealth gap because its disproportionately adding to white wealth. IXK: When it comes to those school boards, I think we have to change power. But at least well know going in the impact of those policies. In other words, they come into the company and train the individual so the individual can be better or be more aware or recognize even potentially their racist ideas. Go deeper into fascinating topics with original video series from TED. And what I make of this whole fiasco I was surprised when I learned that I was the father of critical race theory, when critical race theory was born before I was born. In 1986, as an example, more people died that year from drunk drivers than they did from homicides and drug overdoses. We somehow imagine that that form of analysis is divisive, even though, to me, it will actually bring us together because different communities will be able to see that it is additive for their communities. OK, what type of impact will it have on child poverty within the Black community, within the Native community, within the white community? So let me then ask always a final question here. By the end of the summer, more and more people were asking, how can I raise my child to be anti-racist? 
So let me lay my cards on the table on this one. The last date is today's I do want to push you on whether or not the trade-up is there. As we usher out 2020 the (enter superlative of your choice) year lets take a moment to look back before we close the door for good. I saw that thats what people were looking for, and I try to be responsive. Thank you very much. As always, my email is [emailprotected] Heres Ibram X. Kendi. Our focus should be on the outcome. Racist policies make racists. The Long History of Presidents Getting a Pass, How Vanuatus Climate Campaign Could Save the World, The Movement That Made Brandon Johnson Mayor of Chicago. Racists dont make racist policies. But I am interested in the midpoints here. In the eighteenth century, the burgeoning nation continued to condone slavery in many regions, despite increasing calls for emancipation. And I wanted to push Kendi on some of the hard questions his framework demands we ask of the debates weve had in the past couple of years. The difference between being "not racist" and antiracist | Ibram X. Kendi TED 22.7M subscribers Subscribe 284K views 2 years ago Visit http://TED.com to get So if, for instance, if we know that one aspect of the bill is going to cut childhood poverty in half. It was a call for rigor at a scale politics almost never provides. Going back to an argument you made earlier, I think everything in our history should lead you to believe that we created what the sociologists call or the criminologists call criminogenic conditions in Black communities. How do you think about policies where they would undoubtedly decrease racial inequality but the political backlash they could create might increase it by electing reactionary politicians? And also let me say, Ezra, from the standpoint of somebody who was a descendant of enslaved people, this was the actual conundrum that enslaved people had to deal with when they decided whether to join that slave revolt that somebody was organizing. Its just become an industry. So I agree over the past year, and I want to put a pin in the question of the cause of crime because I think its a really important part of the theory here. 
Already a member? And that case was, well, lets just essentially focus on the intent and argue that the only policies that are racist are the policies that, quote, have racial language in them.. #EquityTalks #IbramXKendiSee more videos like this via http://g.co/TalksAtGoogle/RacialEquity What we dont talk as much about during the Civil Rights movement is the crisis of the Cold War and the relationship that the United States was having to newly decolonized nations in Africa and Latin America and Asia, especially when the Soviet Union was hammering the United States on the way it was treating Black people as the United States and Soviet Union competed over markets and political influence in different countries. As always, my email is [emailprotected] Heres Ibram X. Kendi. I mention the White community because there are certain segments of our society that tries to promote that bills like that arent going to be helpful for white people. EZRA KLEIN: Right. And I want to repeat that because it is so important to understanding his thought. eNotes.com, Inc. And its a very thin line between saying that theres no such thing as a dangerous unemployed neighborhood and theres a dangerous Black neighborhood because of unemployment. At the same time, misinformation efforts proliferated the idea that Black people were more likely to live on welfare, more likely to commit crime, and more likely to deal drugs. In all seriousness, I think, in that case, we really would have to think very deeply about, how do we convey and promote this policy in a way that is not going to then lead to this reactionary sort of response. Going back to an argument you made earlier, I think everything in our history should lead you to believe that we created what the sociologists call or the criminologists call criminogenic conditions in Black communities. I think the corporate example is an interesting one here because one of the things youve seen over the past year is a huge investment in diversity, equity, and inclusion trainings in companies. WebHill meets Ibram X. Kendi, who argues in favor or the teaching of systemic racism and critical race theory in schools, and The Heritage Foundation's Mike Gonzalez, a conservative, argues against. But typically, those policies were able to be instituted in the context of a crisis. And there are studies suggesting that when they do that, on the one hand, its good for Black incomes, good for Black employment because it gets the economy moving faster. Teachers and parents! But even more importantly, what I found, especially in the turn after civil rights, that those who were seeking to maintain racism through Jim Crow segregation and separate-but-equal policies, by the early 1970s, they were making a different case to maintain and conserve racial inequity and injustice. Kendi imagines an antiracist world in which every group has its own spaces, and everyone can participate in any of them. Thats the irony of it. IBRAM X. KENDI: I dont know if I necessarily agree with scholars who make the case that Black communities have criminogenic conditions. And so thats what I sort of was emphasizing, that at some point were going to have to battle and strive to do what seemingly is impossible, knowing that failure could make things worse. How do you think about the question of whether defunding the police is an antiracist policy? Because one thing white Americans are not taught, because we dont teach about race and racism with any specificity or comprehensiveness in schools and even colleges, is about white American history. We have to analyze it. And this largely, as you stated, Ezra, it came out of my research in Stamped From The Beginning, which was this sweeping history of anti-Black racist ideas. He was interviewed by Laura Flanders with Mitra S. Kalita and Sara Lomax-Reese, the cofounders of URL Media, on The Laura Flanders Show on April 6. It was a call for rigor at a scale politics almost never provides. tn_ptype: 'article', TLFS: Youve really leaned into the childrens aspectand the power of individuals that you speak of often. And I think sometimes when people say, well, Im just picking my battle, well, this is politically hazardous, thats politically hazardous, so I just got to wait until theres something more politically advantageous. And this is all playing out the exact same time as a health care reform is. If there are two dates, the date of publication and appearance I think its important first for parents to realize that their non-verbal language says a lot to children. And if its a more grounded way to ask the question, how do you think about some of the choices Obama made there? And I had other goals to get done, things like passing the Affordable Care Act, which did reduce racial inequality in health care provision. Can you talk me through that? And then the world changed, your role in the world changed. He divides the book into five sections, each of which revolves around the life of a person who contributed significantly to the discourse around racespecifically regarding the dynamics between Black and White Americans. It is produced by Jeff Geld, Roge Karma and Annie Galvin, fact-checked by Michelle Harris, original music by Isaac Jones, and mixing by Jeff Geld. In Mrs. Dalloway, why did Clarissa reject Peter Walsh and marry Richard? But what it also speaks to is the current crisis, the crisis of COVID-19, or even the crisis of democracy, or even the crisis of Trumpism could potentially open the door for people to be willing to be daring or countervailing forces allowing particular elected officials to support something that in another time may not be sound politically. Exactly. I didnt know how people would respond. (including. IBRAM X. KENDI: Well, what it means to be antiracist is to first recognize that we live in a society of racial inequities, from wealth to health to criminal justice to education, and to recognize that weve been taught that, lets say, Black people are disproportionately impoverished or incarcerated because theres something wrong with Black people behaviorally or culturally. Slavery in many regions, despite increasing calls for emancipation christopher Rufo, whos sort of the summer, people. My head as you were talking is I recently did an interview with former President Obama and.. 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